IBIS Macromodel Task Group Meeting date: 12 October 2010 Members (asterisk for those attending): Adge Hawes, IBM Ambrish Varma, Cadence Design Systems Anders Ekholm, Ericsson * Arpad Muranyi, Mentor Graphics Corp. Barry Katz, SiSoft * Bob Ross, Teraspeed Consulting Group Brad Brim, Sigrity Brad Griffin, Cadence Design Systems Chris Herrick, Ansoft Chris McGrath, Synopsys Danil Kirsanov, Ansoft David Banas, Xilinx Deepak Ramaswany, Ansoft Donald Telian, consultant Doug White, Cisco Systems * Eckhard Lenski, Nokia-Siemens Networks Eckhard Miersch, Sigrity Eric Sweetman, Vitesse Semiconductor Essaid Bensoudane, ST Microelectronics * Fangyi Rao, Agilent Ganesh Narayanaswamy, ST Micro Gang Kang, Sigrity Hemant Shah, Cadence Design Systems Ian Dodd, consultant Jerry Chuang, Xilinx Joe Abler, IBM * John Angulo, Mentor Graphics John Shields, Mentor Graphics * Ken Willis, Sigrity Kellee Crisafulli, Celsionix Kumar Keshavan, Sigrity Lance Wang, Cadence Design Systems Luis Boluna, Cisco Systems * Michael Mirmak, Intel Corp. * Mike LaBonte, Cisco Systems Mike Steinberger, SiSoft Mustansir Fanaswalla, Xilinx Patrick O'Halloran, Tiburon Design Automation Paul Fernando, NCSU Pavani Jella, TI Radek Biernacki, Agilent (EESof) Randy Wolff, Micron Technology Ray Komow, Cadence Design Systems Richard Mellitz, Intel Richard Ward, Texas Instruments Samuel Mertens, Ansoft Sam Chitwood, Sigrity Sanjeev Gupta, Agilent * Scott McMorrow, Teraspeed Consulting Group Shangli Wu, Cadence Design Systems Sid Singh, Extreme Networks Stephen Scearce, Cisco Systems Steve Kaufer, Mentor Graphics Steve Pytel, Ansoft Syed Huq, Cisco Systems Syed Sadeghi, ST Micro Ted Mido, Synopsys Terry Jernberg, Cadence Design Systems * Todd Westerhoff, SiSoft Vladimir Dmitriev-Zdorov, Mentor Graphics Vikas Gupta, Xilinx Vuk Borich, Agilent * Walter Katz, SiSoft Wenyi Jin, LSI Logic * Zhen Mu, Mentor Graphics ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Opens: - Mike L: Would like to address task group protocol changes suggested by Michael Mirmak -------------------------- Call for patent disclosure: - none ------------- Review of ARs: - Arpad address BIRD 114.2 escape sequences in strings - Have not heard back from Anders - It may be voted as is - Arpad: Write parameter passing syntax proposal (BIRD draft) for -AMS models in IBIS that is consistent with the parameter passing syntax of the AMI models - Done, BIRD 117 & 118 submitted - TBD: Propose a parameter passing syntax for the SPICE - [External ...] also? - Done, BIRD 117 & 118 submitted - Arpad: Review the documentation (annotation) in the macro libraries. - Deferred until a demand arises or we have nothing else to do ------------- New Discussion: Arpad: Should we discuss BIRD 119 and IBIS 5.0 AMI corrections? - Walter: I only want to know when we can discuss BIRD 119 - Arpad: Both are targeted for IBIS 5.1, so it can be delayed - It may take another month or two for the corrections - We need rules for the string passed to the DLL - Ken: It is crucial to get the Flow BIRD out - We could focus 2/3 on incremental corrections - Mike L: We should multi-task only if one can be discussed in short segments - Arpad: We should discuss BIRD 119 after the corrections are done - Anything can be discussed on the reflector - Todd: That would not be a good use of our time - Would rather discuss mixed topics Walter motioned to set the agenda for the next meeting, each meeting: - Mike L seconded - No one objected in an acclamation vote - The motion passed Arpad: Do we want to deprecate Format? - Todd: We said in emails: - SiSoft sees it as an accident - Some would have to update models and code - This would be the first time the parser would have to parse differently for each version - Three options: - Option 1: Format not allowed - Option 2: Format optional - The parser change would be minimal - Option 3: Format required - Option 2 would be best - Arpad: Do we want to go so far as to disallow it? - Bob: Two vendors favored keeping Format - There could be a "not recommended for future use" comment - Arpad: If we allow the keyword Format then Value and Default have to be OK - Arpad showed item 21 in the work list - Parentheses would have to be inserted before Table to make it work -It would be easier to take Format out - Walter: When a parser sees Format it only has to discard and parse as though it was never there - Our documentation would not show Format, other than a note - Todd: Format creates a self-consistent language - We could say a keyword in {} has no arguments - Ken motioned to vote on the 3 options - Bob: We can have a runoff if there is a tie - Votes: Agilent illegal Cisco Systems optional Intel Corp. optional Mentor Graphics Corp. illegal Nokia-Siemens Networks optional Sigrity required SiSoft optional Teraspeed Consulting Group optional - Finally tally: optional 5 illegal 2 required 1 Arpad: Should Format be removed from docs? - Walter: Bob disagrees with that - Walter motioned that Format is removed from examples and described in a note about it's use in 5.0 - Arpad seconded - Some discussion: - Bob motioned that example should be consistent - All syntactical descriptions should include Format as allowed - Arpad: It will be difficult to write the spec for this - John: A footnote could explain the use of Format - Arpad: Default makes a new leaf - We would have to clearly describe both old and new rules - Bob: This - Mike: Maybe we need to see the proposed changes in the draft - Walter: I would like to see it without the {} - Michael M: The motion can be tabled until next time - Walter withdrew his motion AR: Arpad rework BIRD draft to include Walter's ideas about Format documentation Next agenda: - Arpad's new BIRD draft with - Walter's Default wording email - BIRD 119 - Any other new BIRDs Next meeting: 19 October 2010 12:00pm PT -------- IBIS Interconnect SPICE Wish List: 1) Simulator directives